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Second BIAB - Lloydies Krispy Kolsche; now in the glass!

Post #1 made 15 years ago
by brad
Hi!

Ok, So I have now poured the first glass of KK.

Started at 1.056 and finished at 1.010

I used a Wyeast 'activator' that was made for Kolsche as I could not find the K-97 at the time.

First impressions.. To me tastes a bit like Hoegaarden. Very fruity, slight maltiness, full bodied but not keeping a head.

I think maybe it was a bit high in fermentation temps. The thermometer said 18 for the duration but maybe it needed calibration.

Can anyone comment on what the expected taste is? Should it be like a Hoegaarden style? (Ive never had a real Kolsche..). Just want to know if I'm on the right track or if something went very bad!) I dont mind it but Id prefer a little less fruity. I can feel the alcohol content though.. ;) I dont think we will have trouble finishing it off.

Also, when I was draining the wort into cubes, I got a full 15ltr cube, and then there was another 8 litres. I emptied this into another cube, but as it didnt fill right up, I did not want to mix them together(in case of infections) so fermented them separately. However, with the 8litres I used S04 yeast as thats all I had. I plan to bottle this one rather than keg (all 4 kegs full atm..). What are your thoughts on this style with the S04 yeast? Brewed at same temps.

Cheers,

Brad

Post #2 made 15 years ago
by wizard78
Hopefully Pistolpatch can chime in here as I think it is one of his regulars.
It is possible that the yeast is giving the fruity taste.
From a conversation I had with PP, IIRC, this beer is supposed to be like a psuedo lager.
It will be interesting to here some more info on tastes of this beer cause it is next on my list, I even managed to get the K-97, which is hard to get hold of, particulary in Melbourne. :angry:
Keep us up to date with any changes in taste, with age, if it lasts that long :drink: :lol:
[center]"All right, brain. You don't like me and I don't like you, but let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer."
[/center]
[center]Homer Simpson[/center]
[center]K.I.S.S., B.I.A.B.[/center]

Post #3 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
The majority of Kolsch's will exhibit that slight fruitiness but this can be highly manipulated, even avoided, by the fermentation temperature. Kolsch is a bit like wheat beer in that respect - you can get hugely varying flavours through fermentation temperature alone.

Your thermometer is probably right brad. At 18 degrees, Lloyd's Krispy Kolsch will not be, "crispy," i.e. it will not be a pseudo lager. So, you will taste the fruitiness etc that you have described. If you want to avoid this and go, "crispy," then you want to be fermenting this at 15 degrees*.

...

*Big problem... I just looked at the recipe section and noticed that the BIABrewer templates do not have any place to list the fermentation temperature. How to brew this Kolsch as, "crispy." is only explained in The Commentary. I'll let BIABbrewer know about this ommision and hopefully we'll see all the recipes corrected in the next week or so.

...

My palate is not a fan of fruitiness, cloves, banana etc. in beer. I find them too overpowering so I am unable to taste anything else. If you are in the unfortunate position of having a palate like mine brad, then you may not love this batch. Plenty of other brewers would love it so any disappointment should be blamed on the instructions and not your brewing.

Lack of head could be just the glass you are using as no matter what temp this is fermented at, it usually holds a good head. If you are getting this in all your beers then I'd worry about it. On a single batch or taste, then let it slide.

Ferementing with the S04 is most likely to personify the fruitiness so don't hold your breath for any more crispiness. If you were after the crispy, "pseudo-lager," then both these split batches might be disappointing. The upside is that when you brew it again at 15 C, you will be amazed at the difference in flavour. To get it really crispy, you need to tightly manage the fermentation temp - for example, if you let it slip up to say 17 C, especially in the first few active days of fermentation, you'll most likely see the fruitiness of the normal Kolsch.

Even with some fruitiness, it's still a refreshing beer.

Good luck Brad - hope your palate still enjoys it!
PP

P.S. Wiz, I need some of that dried yeast as I have only used liquid before. I'll be PM'ing you soon ;).
Last edited by PistolPatch on 01 Nov 2010, 20:19, edited 5 times in total.
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Post #4 made 15 years ago
by wizard78
I knew you were the man to see PP :salute:
[center]"All right, brain. You don't like me and I don't like you, but let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer."
[/center]
[center]Homer Simpson[/center]
[center]K.I.S.S., B.I.A.B.[/center]

Post #5 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
:nup: LoydieP would write a lot better on this. I'll send him a PM now to see if I can rouse him from his hibernation. It's a constant job to get him to post rather than just :dream: about brewing :roll: ;)
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Post #6 made 15 years ago
by brad
Thanks for the replies guys!

PP, I am a bit like yourself, not too keen on the fruitiness! Ill 'attempt' to leave it be for a few weeks in the fridge and see how it goes after that. Unfortunately, Ive tried that before.. never makes it to the end ;)

If I manage to leave it, Ill report back on any changes. :)

Cheers,

Brad

Post #7 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
brad wrote:I am a bit like yourself, not too keen on the fruitiness! Ill 'attempt' to leave it be for a few weeks in the fridge and see how it goes after that.
:peace: Fingers crossed for you Brad.
Last edited by PistolPatch on 03 Nov 2010, 20:27, edited 5 times in total.
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Post #8 made 15 years ago
by brad
Well, it is now 2 weeks.. The fruity flavour has mellowed a tad, but not a great deal. Its still very.. Hoegaarden'ish ;)
Drinkable none the less, but I fear I wont be able to test it at the 4 week mark.. the kegs nearly gone. :)

Post #9 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
Yep, I feared this. My commisserations brad.

We now know that the only way to go is for a low blow ;)

Yep, for Krispy brew low!

Hope it was okay for you though????

PP
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Post #10 made 15 years ago
by LloydieP
Hey boys my computer, car and dog died all on the same day. I've just grabbed Paulie's lappy for a quick catch up.

PP's got it with the head. I've turned into a glass nazi lately. Perfectly good beer and no head.... :shoot: Never use detergent! You cannot rinse it properly! Rinse in hot water straight away and done. Every now and then give them a good scrub. Then rinse with ACID. Vineger, (strong) STARSAN, or even METHO. Having said that some yeasts hold a better head than others which suggests something in the fermentation has an an effect on head retention.. Something to research...

Now the Kolsh...

15 degrees is pretty midrange for the K-97 slash Wyeast 1007 German Ale Yeast. The KRISPYest I've done was at 12 degrees with no problems. 1007 is a classic hybrid yeast so it'll be a lager yeast or an ale yeast depending on not much more than temp (funny huh?) Doesn't like hops much without a long conditioning rest, but that's cos it's pretending to be a lager yeast!! :dream:

I reckon fermentation temp is your only worry there Brad, if head remains an issue whack a bit more wheat malt in, it's well accepted in a Kolsh.




Something I learnt from PP real early was that. if you're not into big yeastie flavour profiles (clovey, bannanary etc), go the bottom half of it's fermentation range.. :salute: The Vienna malt will add to any estery-type flavours, but will add some real malty notes if fermented low. The problem we had with the KRISPY KOLSH recipe was using a DRY yeast, but the k-97 is pretty much the 1007.

Cheers. Off then :sneak:
Lloydie
[center]"Eat my sugar, man[/center]

Post #11 made 15 years ago
by BobBrews
Lloydie,
Sounds like you had a bad day. Lets hope you have a better year in 2011. The next time you come over to my place there is a beer ready to cheer you up!
tap 1 Raspberry wine
tap 2 Bourbon Barrel Porter
tap 3 Czech Pilsner
tap 4 Triple IPA 11% ABV
Pipeline: Mulled Cider 10% ABV

http://cheesestradamus.com/ Brewers challenge!
    • SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America

Post #12 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
Yep, he did have a bad day Bob :argh:. Managed to have a phone chat with him the other day and he is still ploughing on with his brewing investigations and experiments :champ:.

Always great to read Lloydie's posts, educational and always in great humour but never enough of them :sad:.

How are you going with your experiment Brad. Haven't seen you here in a month :!:
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