I've been using NC cubes for my last 5 brews and something has always bothered me. At what stage do you start the transfer of the hot wort to the cube? I've always done it as soon as possible after flameout (within 5-10 minutes) which means that I'm getting a lot of break material into the cube. I'm scared that if I leave the wort for too long (wirlpool or waiting for break material to settle) then it will not be hot enough to sanitise the cube.
I normally leave this break material, or most of it, behind when transferring the wort to the fermenter but I want to start fermenting my beer in the cubes - all I want to do is to is pitch the yeast and replace the cube lid with one customised to take an airlock.
So, is there an "optimum" (enought time for the break material to settle but still hot enough to sanitise the cube) temperature at which to transfer wort from the kettle to the cube? Feedback on when others do transfer to cube will be much appreciated!
Lambert
Post #2 made 14 years ago
Hi Lambert
I don't NC but I would think that sanatising your cube with Starsan/Idophor would eliminate any contamination worries from cooler wort. You could also transfer hot wort to one cube, leave overnight to cool and settle then transfer to another sanatised cube for fermenting.
Out of interest how do you propose to oxygenate your wort?
Yeasty
I don't NC but I would think that sanatising your cube with Starsan/Idophor would eliminate any contamination worries from cooler wort. You could also transfer hot wort to one cube, leave overnight to cool and settle then transfer to another sanatised cube for fermenting.
Out of interest how do you propose to oxygenate your wort?
Yeasty
Why is everyone talking about "Cheese"
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Post #3 made 14 years ago
Hi Yeasty
I do sanitise the cube even if I transfer the wort while its still very hot - I guess I'm a bit OTT when it comes to sanitising stuff for brewing. I also want to eliminate the transfer of wort - it's just another chance for infection - and I'm a lazy twit
.
My brew lengths are normally between 12 and 18L and I've recently got hold of 20L cubes. I imagine that if I give the cubes a good shake before pitching the yeast there should be enough oxygen in the wort. Failing that, there is always the "miniscule drop of olive oil" method
...
l
I do sanitise the cube even if I transfer the wort while its still very hot - I guess I'm a bit OTT when it comes to sanitising stuff for brewing. I also want to eliminate the transfer of wort - it's just another chance for infection - and I'm a lazy twit
.My brew lengths are normally between 12 and 18L and I've recently got hold of 20L cubes. I imagine that if I give the cubes a good shake before pitching the yeast there should be enough oxygen in the wort. Failing that, there is always the "miniscule drop of olive oil" method
...l
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Post #4 made 14 years ago
I usually wait about 20-25 minutes before I transfer my wort to a cube.
That way, most of the break has settled and I get mostly clear wort into the cube. I then give it a quick squeeze to get most of the air out, put the lid on then rest the cube on its side to help sanitise the handle and lid.
I don't worry too much about the break material going into the cube. I have done double batches where one cube had next to no break in it and the other had heaps and I couldn't tell the difference.
I haven't pitched into my cubes so can't comment on it.
HC
That way, most of the break has settled and I get mostly clear wort into the cube. I then give it a quick squeeze to get most of the air out, put the lid on then rest the cube on its side to help sanitise the handle and lid.
I don't worry too much about the break material going into the cube. I have done double batches where one cube had next to no break in it and the other had heaps and I couldn't tell the difference.
I haven't pitched into my cubes so can't comment on it.
HC
Part of the NoAd brewers
My mum says I'm cool.
My mum says I'm cool.
Post #5 made 14 years ago
lambert, I'm with you. I transfer somewhere between flame out and 5 minutes. I don't bother about the break material getting into anything. The whole lot gets dumped into the fermenter.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."
Post #6 made 14 years ago
Good Day, I took some time to check, 140F/60C is the minimum temperature for safe using. Anything lower CANNOT stop germs/bacteria/wild yeast.
Just a note.... My "No chill" wort takes 4 hours to drop to 140F/60C. Maybe in cooler places it will happen quicker, But after 1 hour the junk has dropped out and is easy to siphon into my No-Chill tank.
Just my .0108 Euro.
Just a note.... My "No chill" wort takes 4 hours to drop to 140F/60C. Maybe in cooler places it will happen quicker, But after 1 hour the junk has dropped out and is easy to siphon into my No-Chill tank.
Just my .0108 Euro.
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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Post #7 made 14 years ago
All, thanks for the info! I should be safe with a combination of a starsan'ed cube and transferring wort within an hour. I'll have to experiment a bit and find my "comfort zone" of transferring to the cube - at least I know I've got a reasonable time-frame to play with. It would be nice to have "break free" wort but then again, if it does not affect the quality of the beer....
@hashie - just to make sure I'm reading you correctly - you are FERMENTING with all the break material in the cube/fermenter? Doesn't it affect your beer if it's in the primary for, say, 3 weeks?
@hashie - just to make sure I'm reading you correctly - you are FERMENTING with all the break material in the cube/fermenter? Doesn't it affect your beer if it's in the primary for, say, 3 weeks?
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Post #8 made 14 years ago
I starsan my cube with 3L shaking it at various stages in the boil
At flameout I immediately start a wicked whirlpool and put the lid on
I then prep everything and start a siphon pretty much as soon as the wort stops moving, or even earlier
I siphon from the top down so the junk has time to fall
I can generally get all but the last 1.5L, which I then sieve into a jug, give a quick boil on the stove and throw into a growler or flaggon for settling in the fridge. That'll make my starter
When I'm pouring my cube I leave the layer of break which has formed (look for a colour change while pouring). This gives me a nice clean compact yeast cake
At flameout I immediately start a wicked whirlpool and put the lid on
I then prep everything and start a siphon pretty much as soon as the wort stops moving, or even earlier
I siphon from the top down so the junk has time to fall
I can generally get all but the last 1.5L, which I then sieve into a jug, give a quick boil on the stove and throw into a growler or flaggon for settling in the fridge. That'll make my starter
When I'm pouring my cube I leave the layer of break which has formed (look for a colour change while pouring). This gives me a nice clean compact yeast cake
Fermenting: -
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
Post #9 made 14 years ago
I use a safety siphon starter btw!
Fermenting: -
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
Post #10 made 14 years ago
Yes, I ferment trub and all. But, let me qualify that by saying that I use a stainless conical fermenter, so I can dump all/most of the trub and inactive yeast cell off the beer aftre a few days, or every day. I haven't noticed any problems in my beers (others might) and some experts say that the trub is a yeast nutrient and is therefore beneficial to your brew.lambert wrote: e
@hashie - just to make sure I'm reading you correctly - you are FERMENTING with all the break material in the cube/fermenter? Doesn't it affect your beer if it's in the primary for, say, 3 weeks?
Horses for courses, it works for me, it may work for you.
Cheers
Last edited by hashie on 20 Oct 2011, 13:31, edited 5 times in total.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."
Post #11 made 14 years ago
@hashie - thanks, I feel an experiment coming up...
@stux - I assume that you re-boil the filtered starter wort to sterilise it? I've been wondering if it will be ok to filter the wort, pop it into the fridge and re-boil it on the day that I want to make the starter? Would that kill off possible infections the happened between the boil and the bottling process?
@stux - I assume that you re-boil the filtered starter wort to sterilise it? I've been wondering if it will be ok to filter the wort, pop it into the fridge and re-boil it on the day that I want to make the starter? Would that kill off possible infections the happened between the boil and the bottling process?
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Post #12 made 14 years ago
Yes, I reboil it. Its inevitably full of beasties by this stage... I suspect if you sanitized your sieve it would not be so bad.
Although, I don't always get around to it, and when I don't, there is sometimes, but not always, some ick on the top the next day... not so good, but I've always given it a taste, tastes sweet, reboiled for 15 minutes and made a starter anyway.
When my starter is ready to pitch I chill it and decant the heavily oxidized wort anyway (stirplate)
So,
Pour your kettle dregs through a sieve, give a quick boil, then pour into a sanitized bottle (you may want to warm the bottle to avoid shattering) and chill (with a loose top/foil if glass) then use that to make a starter.
To make the starter, decant the clear liquid off the top of the trub, take a gravity reading, dilute back to 1.040 by if necessary, add 10 grams DME per 100ml of water to make up any shortfall in your starter volume, add a pinch of yeast nutrient and then boil for 15 minutes.
1.050 wort can be diluted to 1.040 by adding 25% extra water.
Cover and cool, then pitch your starter yeast (i use subdivided wyeast packs)
I'll normally lose 250ml to hop trub and stuff in the sieve, gaining about 1-2L or so of liquid that I bottle. I'll end up decanting about 75% or so of that, which I'll dilute to to bring back to 1.040, possibly making up any extra with some DME
...
Its nice to boil/cool in an erlenmeyer flask. You can boil directly on the gas hob and then cool in a sink.
Although, I don't always get around to it, and when I don't, there is sometimes, but not always, some ick on the top the next day... not so good, but I've always given it a taste, tastes sweet, reboiled for 15 minutes and made a starter anyway.
When my starter is ready to pitch I chill it and decant the heavily oxidized wort anyway (stirplate)
So,
Pour your kettle dregs through a sieve, give a quick boil, then pour into a sanitized bottle (you may want to warm the bottle to avoid shattering) and chill (with a loose top/foil if glass) then use that to make a starter.
To make the starter, decant the clear liquid off the top of the trub, take a gravity reading, dilute back to 1.040 by if necessary, add 10 grams DME per 100ml of water to make up any shortfall in your starter volume, add a pinch of yeast nutrient and then boil for 15 minutes.
1.050 wort can be diluted to 1.040 by adding 25% extra water.
Cover and cool, then pitch your starter yeast (i use subdivided wyeast packs)
I'll normally lose 250ml to hop trub and stuff in the sieve, gaining about 1-2L or so of liquid that I bottle. I'll end up decanting about 75% or so of that, which I'll dilute to to bring back to 1.040, possibly making up any extra with some DME
...
Its nice to boil/cool in an erlenmeyer flask. You can boil directly on the gas hob and then cool in a sink.
Fermenting: -
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
Post #13 made 14 years ago
hashie, you once said "lambert, I'm with you. I transfer somewhere between flame out and 5 minutes. I don't bother about the break material getting into anything. The whole lot gets dumped into the fermenter"
Do you use any whirfloc or IM,I don't see much reason to,but........
Do you use any whirfloc or IM,I don't see much reason to,but........
AWOL
Post #14 made 14 years ago
No Lylo, I don't use ant kettle finings, or fermentor finings either. Nor do I filter prior to kegging or bottling.
The way I see it, I am making beer. I think it tastes good and I think it looks good. I am the only person I am trying to impress and I impress easily
The way I see it, I am making beer. I think it tastes good and I think it looks good. I am the only person I am trying to impress and I impress easily
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."
Post #15 made 14 years ago
You have impressed me and although you are a young fella,you have now become my role model.
Poster boy for KISS.
Poster boy for KISS.
AWOL
Post #16 made 14 years ago
I usually whirlpool and leave for 30 minutes with the lid on. I wash the cube with sodium percarbonate, then spray with idophore drain upside down for a while and then put the lid on till i am ready to fill it up.
While it might cool down a bit more, i've never had an infection doing it this way. When i drain into the cube I get very little trub, it is all nicely clumped at the bottom of the pot. Maybe I leave it too long, it seems to work well.
In regards to the customised airlock on the cube, just get some cling wrap, put it over the cube opening and put an elastic band around it, works great. I also do this with my 25L fermenter and use the rubber seal ring to hold down the cling wrap. My fermenter lids are now all sitting in the corner gathering dust.
While it might cool down a bit more, i've never had an infection doing it this way. When i drain into the cube I get very little trub, it is all nicely clumped at the bottom of the pot. Maybe I leave it too long, it seems to work well.
In regards to the customised airlock on the cube, just get some cling wrap, put it over the cube opening and put an elastic band around it, works great. I also do this with my 25L fermenter and use the rubber seal ring to hold down the cling wrap. My fermenter lids are now all sitting in the corner gathering dust.
Post #17 made 14 years ago
Here's a use for your fermenter lidsAces high wrote:My fermenter lids are now all sitting in the corner gathering dust.
Tight-Arse Stir Plate
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/i" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... t&p=786613
Large strong surface area.... easy to centre starter... convenient overflow catchment... and convenient access to innards
PS: not mine
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Last edited by stux on 11 Nov 2011, 11:11, edited 5 times in total.
Fermenting: -
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
Cubed: -
Stirplate: -
On Tap: NS Summer Ale III (WY1272), Landlord III (WY1469), Fighter's 70/- II (WY1272), Roast Porter (WY1028), Cider, Soda
Next: Munich Helles III
5/7/12
