As a total novice at AG my understanding is that the late hops i.e. those added within last 15 minutes of the boil are the ones which add aroma and flavour, while the start of boil hops give the bitterness.
So how much does the variety of bittering hop affect the overall flavour of the beer? I know that different ones have different alpha acid percentages but assuming the relevant quantity is used to provide the same number of IBUs will there be a marked difference using one hop rather than another?
Post #2 made 13 years ago
Many feel they achieve a rounder hop profile by using larger quantities of lower alpha hops.However I think most of us achieve our bittering numbers from the higher alphas. ThIs helps keep the dollars down and as far as this palate can tell,no difference!
AWOL
Post #3 made 13 years ago
Jeltz, Lylo is correct, and I have found most High alpha hops DO have flavor that can remain thoughout the Boil, and need to be considered with the Flavor and Aroma hops used.
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
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Post #4 made 13 years ago
If you just want neutral bittering because the flavor will come from late additions I would recommend using Magnum hops. This is a high AA low flavor hop that can be bought in bulk quite cheaply. A lot of brewers use Magnum as their bittering charge because it's cheap and you don't need very much.
I've taken to doing a FWH to provide all my bittering lately and that requires using a more flavorful hop as the flavor does cary through to the final product.
---Todd
I've taken to doing a FWH to provide all my bittering lately and that requires using a more flavorful hop as the flavor does cary through to the final product.
---Todd
WWBBD?
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- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
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Post #5 made 13 years ago
Pardon my ignorance but I've been reading around and I wonder if you could confirm my understanding/explain a little further.
FWH is first wort hopping and that is making a hop addition to the wort immediately after the mash stage (i.e. once the bag is raised) but before a boil is reached. If so should the wort be left for any time before I switch on the element (with an electric boiler) or just pop them in, switch on and bring to a boil?
Brew target suggests that there is a significant drop in bittering units produced by FWH over addition at 60mins, is that right?
FWH is first wort hopping and that is making a hop addition to the wort immediately after the mash stage (i.e. once the bag is raised) but before a boil is reached. If so should the wort be left for any time before I switch on the element (with an electric boiler) or just pop them in, switch on and bring to a boil?
Brew target suggests that there is a significant drop in bittering units produced by FWH over addition at 60mins, is that right?
Regards
Nic
Nic
Post #6 made 13 years ago
Good Day Jeltz, I have found the FWH does drop the "Harsh" Bittering, but adds a "smooth" bittering much more.
So if you believe BrewTarget, Set the Bittering amount as "60/90/120 minute" to get the correct IBU, and use that amount of bittering Hops as FWH.
The biterness will be there, but a smooth, easy bitterness in the beer.
The total time for maximum Bitter hops is believed to be 120minutes. So setting the FWH IBU can be made from the estimated time from "mashout" to "end of boil"
This is only what I have determined over the last 22 batchs, so you may have a much different results....
(discliamer)
"Past performace of a brew is not any indication of future brew performance or cost"
So if you believe BrewTarget, Set the Bittering amount as "60/90/120 minute" to get the correct IBU, and use that amount of bittering Hops as FWH.
The biterness will be there, but a smooth, easy bitterness in the beer.
The total time for maximum Bitter hops is believed to be 120minutes. So setting the FWH IBU can be made from the estimated time from "mashout" to "end of boil"
This is only what I have determined over the last 22 batchs, so you may have a much different results....
(discliamer)
"Past performace of a brew is not any indication of future brew performance or cost"
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
-
- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
-
Post #7 made 13 years ago
joshua,do you have a method for calculating your FWH with our BIABACUS?
AWOL
Post #8 made 13 years ago
Nic,
Joshua is correct on the bittering contribution of the FWH. I adjust my software so that the FWH gives the same IBU as a 60 minute addition. It seems to add the correct bitterness but it is much more mellow/smooth....as Joshua also stated.
Afterall, the hops are in the wort for 60 minutes plus, correct? So why would they provide less bittering than a standard 60 minute addition? (That is a question for the software developers, not you. Seems like the software guys are listening to the common old wive's tales regarding FWH!).
I wish people would stop repeating "facts" as Gospel without actually trying something for themselves. I prefer to question the established "rules" and make my own conclusions. I like to believe that's the same kind of spirit that caused the first BIAB'er to question 3V brewing.
---Todd
Joshua is correct on the bittering contribution of the FWH. I adjust my software so that the FWH gives the same IBU as a 60 minute addition. It seems to add the correct bitterness but it is much more mellow/smooth....as Joshua also stated.
Afterall, the hops are in the wort for 60 minutes plus, correct? So why would they provide less bittering than a standard 60 minute addition? (That is a question for the software developers, not you. Seems like the software guys are listening to the common old wive's tales regarding FWH!).
I wish people would stop repeating "facts" as Gospel without actually trying something for themselves. I prefer to question the established "rules" and make my own conclusions. I like to believe that's the same kind of spirit that caused the first BIAB'er to question 3V brewing.
---Todd
WWBBD?
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- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
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Post #9 made 13 years ago
Lylo, I don't have a way to work on BIABACUS, But at this time, I Seem to think the "FWH IBU" is the total time from dropping the hops at Mashout until flameout/Hops pulled.
So if it takes 20 minutes from Mashout to Boil, and the Boil is 60minutes, the FWH time would be 80 minutes for the IBU calculations.
The difference of bitterness from FWH is it doesn't taste bitter as you start to drink the beer, but will give a full bitterness at the Finish, at the back of the tongue.
So, some say it reduces bitterness, BUT, the bitterness can be TOO Strong at the Finish, if the IBU is set too high!!
The "IBU per minute" has a picture at http://www.flickr.com/photos/39471458@N07/3711747176/ for a 100 minute time to see how bitterness changes over boil time.
So if it takes 20 minutes from Mashout to Boil, and the Boil is 60minutes, the FWH time would be 80 minutes for the IBU calculations.
The difference of bitterness from FWH is it doesn't taste bitter as you start to drink the beer, but will give a full bitterness at the Finish, at the back of the tongue.
So, some say it reduces bitterness, BUT, the bitterness can be TOO Strong at the Finish, if the IBU is set too high!!
The "IBU per minute" has a picture at http://www.flickr.com/photos/39471458@N07/3711747176/ for a 100 minute time to see how bitterness changes over boil time.
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
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Post #10 made 13 years ago
Well it did seem odd that given they are in there for the duration that the level of bitterness would be different but then again there may have been processes at work which I was unaware of.
Thanks fellas.
Thanks fellas.
Regards
Nic
Nic
