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SNPA Clone recipe check

Post #1 made 9 years ago
by Streamer
Hi all. I've brewed the All Amarillo APA 3 times now and I've decided to try something different. This time a Sierra Nevada clone. I copied the recipe from somewhere on this site a couple months ago and now can't find it's origin - my apologies to the brewer who first posted it! I did make adjustments for my equipment, and changed out one line for the addition of 1/2 tablet Whirlfloc.
One question I have is the last addition of the Cascade hops at 0 minutes. Do I leave the hops in the hop sack while everything cools and remove them before transferring to the fermentor? Previously I've pulled the hop sacks out at the end of boil, so I'm a little confused.

Anyway, here is what I've got modified to start. I'd appreciate comments after a look to tell me what I've missed or need to alter.

Doing further research I'm questioning using the Maltodextrin. Sounds like it's more for extract. So many questions.

Thanks as always
Sierra Nevada Pale Ale Clone.xlsx
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Last edited by Streamer on 24 Oct 2016, 08:19, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #2 made 9 years ago
by ShorePoints
Streamer, your file looks like you are in good shape. I would add the whirlfloc with less than 10 minutes to go in the boil, but not less than 5 minutes to go.
You can, as you say, leave the hops in the hop sack while everything cools and remove them before transferring to the fermentor. Alternatively, you can pull the hopsock out at a time of your choosing along the way before transferring to the fermenter - those 15 and 0 minute hop additions are the ones that are in play. Once your Temperature gets below ~80 ºC (176 ºF) the isomerization to bitterness is negligible, but flavor contributions continue. If you quickly cool below 80 ºC immediately upon Flame Out (FO), I don't know that you will get all you can from the 0 min. hop addition. That's not the time for dry-hopping, the aroma won't last through packaging time. If it took 45 min. after FO to get to 80 ºC, then your 15 min hops would have been hot for an hour and maybe added more to bitter rather than flavor. It's up to you. There seems to be a lot of room for cooling rate and hops being present to impact the beer.
Dextrose is glucose and is available for immediate consumption (food) by living things like yeast. Maltodextrin is multiple glucose units linked together in various lengths and is not fermented by yeast. Maltodextrin will increase the specific gravity - but not being fermented, its contribution is there in OG as well as FG. Maltodextrin will add to mouthfeel (body) of the beer and aid in head retention. It may also make the beer less dry without making it sweet. Maltodextrins can have varying lengths of those glucose chains and have some sweetness; the plural term is not for just one type.
I hope this helps.
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Post #3 made 9 years ago
by Streamer
Thank you SP, great explanations. Based on reading your reply, I think I'll keep the maltodextrin in play. If I like how this brew turns out I'll start playing with the hop additions - sounds like an interesting way to experiment with flavors. It does take around 30-45 minutes to reach pitching temp, so leaving the 15 and 0 minute hops in makes sense.
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Post #4 made 9 years ago
by Streamer
I brewed this beer today, and I think it will turn out well, but I'm confused on how to interpret my results. First, my projected VIB was 8.91 gallons, my actual was 9.31 gal. The GIB was estimated to be 1.043 and I hit 1.046, and my EIB was 90.7%. I was feeling pretty good at this point.
Mash temps were a concern to me and I managed to keep it within about 1c +/- for 90 minutes.

My VAW was 6.42 gallons vs projected of 6.9 gallons, so I actually ended up boiling off more than projected. This is where I'm confused by the results: my OG was projected at 1.058, but actual was 1.055. I assumed that by boiling off more water than projected, especially starting off with a higher GIB, I would have ended up with a higher OG than projected, not lower.

I'm not dissatisfied with this brew, but I'm confused by the disparity of the OG. I really thought that it would have been higher than projected strictly based on the prior numbers. So what am I missing?

Thanks as always for pulling me along.
Sierra Nevada Pale Ale Clone 11.5.2016.xls
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Last edited by Streamer on 06 Nov 2016, 09:44, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #5 made 9 years ago
by Scott
Hey Streamer,

Long and short...I can't answer your question. Only thing that seems plausible - and this may be incorrect - is if your measurement on one or the other was mismeasured... An accident somewhere is the only thing that makes sense.

I honestly had one of those myself during my last brew where I brewed and tried to do a minor dilution..remeasured and got an even higher gravity. Didn't make sense so I just called it good and...being the end of an extremely long day...finished. Used my initial #s.

So all I could say is...don't worry about it and try to have all your measurements as close as possible in the future... And this is all you can do, right?
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Post #6 made 9 years ago
by Streamer
Thanks Scott. That confirms my un-educated suspicion - an error somewhere along the line. I'll know how it turns out in 6 weeks or so and will post the results.
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Re: SNPA Clone recipe check

Post #7 made 8 years ago
by Streamer
I don't have the knowledge to accurately describe the results, so I'll say first that as an initial run at this I'm generally pleased. Taste wise, I can detect the maltodextrin on the palate, and a light hoppiness comes through, although it's not as bitter as the real thing, and there's not as much hoppiness to the nose or on the palate as I expected. Very drinkable though.
So, I'll brew this again in a couple of weeks, and I'm going to use Scott's method of covering the kettle with a sterilized towel, then cover with a lid, and let it cool down overnight before I transfer to my FV. I use hop sacks for each hop addition, and I'm thinking of just leaving them in the kettle overnight as a way to impart more hops into the finished product. Any thoughts on this?

Thanks as always
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Re: SNPA Clone recipe check

Post #8 made 8 years ago
by Scott
Hey Streamer, Glad to hear things worked out for you!

The cover with a towel thing...didn't come from me. ;)  Might have been PP...  :scratch: 

I think there is a lot more knowledge on hops and hopping yet to be learned. For me...I've tried the "whirlpool at flame out" thing, and it took about 40 minutes to get the temp below 170 deg F, which supposedly where the isomerization of hops stops... Then I used immersion chiller to get temp to 70 degree F range quickly. Final result - plenty of bittering hops, but think much of my flavor hops ended up doing bittering instead, because they were at too high of temperature for too long. 

If your recipe doesn't seem to have enough bittering hops - increase them. If too little flavor - increase hops at the end of the boil. And I always normally add my 0 min hops at 1 minute. Maybe wrong...  :scratch:  My chiller works really well and I want to ensure they add something to the beer before it gets to and drops below 170 deg F. 

I've had some brews recently where I went for larger brew size than normal. Instead of 5.5 Gallons VIF more like 8 gallons. For Hop bag I've been using a large mesh bag...but think it's been too stuffed full of hops in these larger batches, and think this has stopped hops some from fully doing their thing. So a tad Hop-lite... In future I will use a bigger Hop bag (like a BIAB bag), or double up.

And if using the AA listed on the package you could come up some short on bitterness. I use software to adjust variables of time, storage condition and temperature, etc. Not an exact science but think it helps accuracy. I had some posts on this last spring...lots of discussion. I have an Excel file that I use to get a better estimation, using formulas... 

Anyhow, hope this helps move you down the trail a little more... 
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