Hello,
I have played around with BIABacus all night and there are two things I'm thinking of.
1. Shouldn't the mashing time affect efficency estimates? I know that 90 minutes is preferable but if I would like to follow a recipe to the letter and use 60 minutes of mash time shouldn't this then result in a lower efficency? This is NOT to critizise BIABacus in any way but to aid in my learning process.
2. I read somewhere that there or more or less no fermantable sugars in specailty malts. If a recipe calls for, let's say 300grams of caramell malt, what do I need to change in section Y for this particular malt to get a better calculation?
Regards, Olle
Post #2 made 11 years ago
I may be wrong but I believe the majority of the conversion is done in the first 30mins or so. It's possible you may not see a difference in mash efficiency at all just doing a 60 min.
I believe 60min mash is standard for 3 vessel brewers but by the time they have sparged and all that stuff their wort is actually in contact with the grains for more like 90 mins.
If I were you I would ignore the original recipe and do a full 90 min mash.
No need to do anything in section Y. Yes specialty malts do produce very little if no fermentable sugars but they do produce sugars which will in turn increase your gravity so you should treat them the same as a base malt.
Section Y is used mainly for sugar additions like honey or syrup
Balli
I believe 60min mash is standard for 3 vessel brewers but by the time they have sparged and all that stuff their wort is actually in contact with the grains for more like 90 mins.
If I were you I would ignore the original recipe and do a full 90 min mash.
No need to do anything in section Y. Yes specialty malts do produce very little if no fermentable sugars but they do produce sugars which will in turn increase your gravity so you should treat them the same as a base malt.
Section Y is used mainly for sugar additions like honey or syrup
Balli
Post #3 made 11 years ago
OK, thanks a lot for clarifying this.
About the efficency: It's strange though how a recipe I'm doing has an efficency of 73% according to original recipe author with 60 min mash and when I use auto efficency in BIABacus I get nearly 80. The difference in vaporation depending on different pot sizes only account for 1% or so.
,Olle
About the efficency: It's strange though how a recipe I'm doing has an efficency of 73% according to original recipe author with 60 min mash and when I use auto efficency in BIABacus I get nearly 80. The difference in vaporation depending on different pot sizes only account for 1% or so.
,Olle
Post #4 made 11 years ago
I'm not all that clued up on efficacy but what efficiency are you talking about? Mash efficiency? efficiency into boil? efficiency into FV? efficiency into packaging?
Post #5 made 11 years ago
You can expect high efficiency (83% EIK) on an average gravity brew with a pure BIAB full volume mash at 90 mins. and followed by a mashout. We are collecting data on this site which bares this out.
Usually you just take the defaults in the BIABacus section y. Your Viking crystal (38 L) might be between these numbers (71.4 - 75.7%) based on one chart, so I would go with the default.
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Malts_Chart
Usually you just take the defaults in the BIABacus section y. Your Viking crystal (38 L) might be between these numbers (71.4 - 75.7%) based on one chart, so I would go with the default.
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Malts_Chart
Last edited by Mad_Scientist on 02 Apr 2014, 02:21, edited 1 time in total.
-
- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
-
Post #6 made 11 years ago
I would expect this to be "Brewhouse efficency" whatever that is...?balli1990 wrote:I'm not all that clued up on efficacy but what efficiency are you talking about? Mash efficiency? efficiency into boil? efficiency into FV? efficiency into packaging?
Last edited by olleman on 01 Apr 2014, 13:50, edited 1 time in total.
Post #7 made 11 years ago
Ok, so a good way to start with a recipe I'm brewing for the first time is to input all the ingredients. The OG from the recipe, possibly the IBU figure in section D and then let BIABacus do it's thing more or less?Mad_Scientist wrote:You can expect a high efficiency (83% EIK) with a pure BIAB full volume mash at 90 mins. and followed by a mashout. We are collecting data on this site which bares this out.
Usually you just take the defaults in the BIABacus section y. Your Viking crystal (38 L) might be between these numbers (71.4 - 75.7%) based on one chart, so I would go with the default.
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/wiki/index.php/Malts_Chart" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Last edited by olleman on 01 Apr 2014, 13:53, edited 1 time in total.
BIABacus, auto efficency and specialty malts
Post #8 made 11 years ago
This is how I plan on doing it. Just make sure you enter the weight and AA% of the original hops and the AA% of what hops you procure. The spreadsheet will correct for the likely difference in AA% of the hops.olleman wrote:
Ok, so a good way to start with a recipe I'm brewing for the first time is to input all the ingredients. The OG from the recipe, possibly the IBU figure in section D and then let BIABacus do it's thing more or less?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Last edited by gmhowell on 01 Apr 2014, 19:29, edited 1 time in total.
-George
"I ride for the same reason dogs stick their heads out of car windows."
"I ride for the same reason dogs stick their heads out of car windows."
Post #9 made 11 years ago
Okay, I am going to jump in here. Lots of fairly okay to good answers here but on this forum we really need to be finalising threads like this within ten posts at most. So let's rewind and summarise....
First question: Yes, mash time does affect efficiency into the boil. No software allows for this but the BIABacus is working on a formula for it. For now, the BIABacus assumes you do a 90 minute mash which you should be doing anyway. The formula we are working on will probably never be used as 90 minutes looks like the minimum. Instead, a warning that if you mash below 90 minutes EIB will be compromised will probably be used.
Second, Efficiency into Boil (EIB) is a variable. Mad_Scientist needs to edit his post above to include the phrase, "on an average gravity brew." A higher gravity brew will have lower kettle efficiency than a low gravity brew. Naughty MS!!!
Third, someone should have mentioned the importance of the useless terminology that currently exists. Terms like "batch size" and "brewhouse efficiency" are meaningless but are still commonly used. I've written oin this twice already tonight. See here and here.
Finally, your second question....
Specialty malts have plenty of fermentable sugars and what sugars they do have all contribute to OG. The BIABacus defaults are set so as you don't have to worry about questions like this. If you can get the exact specifications for all your malts from the shop you buy them from on each brew and that you have a perfectly accurate thermometer, hydrometer and scales and that you can take exact samples, and if you expand your output to about 40 litres into packaging then the BIABacus defaults are what you should use (sugar or extracts excluded).
No other software is as accurate as the BIABacus but at the same time, a big aim of this site and the BIABacus is to educate brewers into the fact that discrepancies are a part of every home brew. I am very suspicious when any brewer's numbers match the BIABacus estimates. On average they should but on a single brew, they rarely should.
300 grams of caramel malt even if it was pure sugar or pure water would make pretty much zero difference on any normal batch of beer (say 5 gallons into bottles or kegs). BIAB and brewing is easy. Relax and get brewing
.
PP
First question: Yes, mash time does affect efficiency into the boil. No software allows for this but the BIABacus is working on a formula for it. For now, the BIABacus assumes you do a 90 minute mash which you should be doing anyway. The formula we are working on will probably never be used as 90 minutes looks like the minimum. Instead, a warning that if you mash below 90 minutes EIB will be compromised will probably be used.
Second, Efficiency into Boil (EIB) is a variable. Mad_Scientist needs to edit his post above to include the phrase, "on an average gravity brew." A higher gravity brew will have lower kettle efficiency than a low gravity brew. Naughty MS!!!
Third, someone should have mentioned the importance of the useless terminology that currently exists. Terms like "batch size" and "brewhouse efficiency" are meaningless but are still commonly used. I've written oin this twice already tonight. See here and here.
Finally, your second question....
Specialty malts have plenty of fermentable sugars and what sugars they do have all contribute to OG. The BIABacus defaults are set so as you don't have to worry about questions like this. If you can get the exact specifications for all your malts from the shop you buy them from on each brew and that you have a perfectly accurate thermometer, hydrometer and scales and that you can take exact samples, and if you expand your output to about 40 litres into packaging then the BIABacus defaults are what you should use (sugar or extracts excluded).
No other software is as accurate as the BIABacus but at the same time, a big aim of this site and the BIABacus is to educate brewers into the fact that discrepancies are a part of every home brew. I am very suspicious when any brewer's numbers match the BIABacus estimates. On average they should but on a single brew, they rarely should.
300 grams of caramel malt even if it was pure sugar or pure water would make pretty much zero difference on any normal batch of beer (say 5 gallons into bottles or kegs). BIAB and brewing is easy. Relax and get brewing
.PP
Last edited by PistolPatch on 01 Apr 2014, 22:00, edited 1 time in total.
If you have found the above or anything else of value on BIABrewer.info, consider supporting us by getting some BIPs!
-
- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From Australia
-
