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Post #3 made 15 years ago
by jrodie
oh I don't know. I like the double IPA's. I was thinking of taking one of the recipe's and just doubling it and see what happens. I have yet to try BIAB at all though. I thought maybe I should start out a little less ambitious for the first batch which I hope to start in the next couple of weeks.

Post #5 made 15 years ago
by SacSoul
I likes this idea. May have to use it for my belgian strong since I'll be shooting for a very high OG.
Arrogant Bastard Ale: "...Perhaps you think multi-million dollar ad campaigns make a beer taste better. Perhaps you're mouthing your words as you read this."

Post #7 made 15 years ago
by Ralph
Heat loss would be one concern as adding a second batch of grain to mash temperature liquor would drop it by 4C or so (at Maxi/MiniBIAB scale), however extra infusion water, decoction or direct heating would overcome that though. It may be fiddly getting the degree of dry/ sweetness right, but not something that's impossible to overcome at all.
The idea certainly does have some merit, good stuff! :P
[center]Give me a beer and I will move the world. Archimedes[/center]

Post #8 made 15 years ago
by Stitch
I'd imagine efficiencies (sp?) would be hard to hit. I had dramas with an IIPA, on traditional 3 vessel system, stuck sparge being the main one. We estimated 10% ABV, but it came out a little under due to all the mucking around we did just to get it into the kettle.Good luck with it though, no stuck sparges with a bag!
Stitch :)

Post #9 made 15 years ago
by jrodie
I have been thinking and hopefully will do my first AG/BIAB this weekend. Economics being a factor instead of just adding twice the ingredients I was thinking of just using half the water. I'll get half the beer yeah, but it is still just an experiment for fun.

Post #10 made 15 years ago
by SacSoul
jrodie wrote:I have been thinking and hopefully will do my first AG/BIAB this weekend. Economics being a factor instead of just adding twice the ingredients I was thinking of just using half the water. I'll get half the beer yeah, but it is still just an experiment for fun.
That always works, especially for experimental batches. I still have my craptacular Mr. Beer kit from a few years back that I use just for 2 gal experimental stuff.

Another option is to use full grains but slightly less water during mash/boil if pot-size is a problem. You can always dilute post-boil in the fermentor. It is especially good if you are a fan of the caramel flavors that boiling smaller volumes creates. This is my preferred method.
Last edited by SacSoul on 01 Oct 2010, 23:08, edited 5 times in total.
Arrogant Bastard Ale: "...Perhaps you think multi-million dollar ad campaigns make a beer taste better. Perhaps you're mouthing your words as you read this."

Post #11 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
I'm really confused here on what you want jrodie. There are so many solutions but without knowing your equipment, it is impossible to know whether to refer you to Ralph's Mini-BIAB Guide, his Maxi-BIAB guide or to The Commentary. So can you let us know...

1. What equipment you have? For example, what size pot/ketle?
2. What gravity you want to achieve?

This should make things easier.
:)PP
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Post #12 made 15 years ago
by jrodie
well I have a 60 quart aluminum kettle. So I don't think making a 5 gallon batch is a problem. My plan for the weekend was to just brew a 5 gallon hefeweizen AG kit. I thought this was a good start because I happen to have an extract version of the same kit fermenting right now and I thought it would be cool to make a side by side comparison of the two. I was just going to use the step mash temps and times that the recipe calls for. The recipe is designed for a traditional all grain system, but I was under the impression that the sacch rest the recipe speaks of was just done in the bag and kettle.

The "double mash" thing i was talking about was to try and make some kind of super beer by taking two AG double IPA kits and combining the ingredients into one Kettle with the water required for about a 5 gallon batch and see what I came up with. I thought it would be very hard if not impossible to fit that much grain in one bag (or lift it out of the kettle) so that is why I asked if you could use two different bags one after the other.

....

Than I started thinking about the price of putting two different already expensive kits into one beer. So I thought I might get the same results as the method mentioned above by just using half the water instead of twice the ingredients.

Hopefully this is a much better explanation than what I have been giving. I appreciate all the advice you guys are willing to give and hope to contribute myself someday when I get some experience with BIAB. :)

Post #13 made 15 years ago
by hashie
G'day jrodie, Your kettle sure is big enough for a 5 gallon batch. My kettle is 50 litres (53 quarts) and does a 5 gallon batch easily.

Your thoughts on double mashing makes sense. Use 1 AG kit and do a 1/2 sized batch. This will save you money and give the result your looking for. Plus, if it's crap you only have 2 1/2 gallons to struggle through (I'm sure it wont be).

Good luck.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."

Post #15 made 15 years ago
by hashie
Ferment shouldn't be much longer than normal, so long as you have have an appropriate strain of yeast. Not all yeasts like high OG wort, good idea to make sure the one you are going to use is up to the task.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."

Post #17 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
jrodie wrote:I thought it would be very hard if not impossible to fit that much grain in one bag (or lift it out of the kettle) so that is why I asked if you could use two different bags one after the other.
Thanks for the additional info jrodie - sometimes I'm a bit slow :).

I use about 11 kg in my double-batches and this is easy to handle with a pulley system. I have done them by hand in the past and it is a bit heavy and sometimes messy pulling the bag out and dumping it into a bucket.

I don't know how using two different bags would go one after the other because I imagine you'd want to mash each bag for at least an hour, preferably more so it would add time for a start. Certainly an interesting thought though and there wouldn't be any harm in trying it.

For now though going for a smaller batch size for starters sounds like a sensible way to go.

Good luck with it and I bet you'll have fun tasting the difference between the extract and the AG.

Cheers,
PP
Last edited by PistolPatch on 02 Oct 2010, 15:07, edited 5 times in total.
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Post #18 made 15 years ago
by jrodie
Hey guys I gotta another question for you. I finally got all the ingredients and equipment needed together and I really am doing my first BIAB tomorrow!! (unless work interferes) Today I kind of did a dry run with the equipment. I read that with an aluminum kettle it was a good idea to oxidize it before the first use by boiling plain water in it. The question is because everything in the kettle got this chalky residue on it. Do you think this is from minerals in the water? I just used hose water today. I'll be using purified water tomorrow.

Post #19 made 15 years ago
by Ralph
Well done jrodie, excellent work in doing a test run. :P

Aluminium oxidises as soon as it is exposed to the atmosphere, so don't worry about preparing it, it isn't necessary.

The chalky residue is most likely from dissolved salts in the water precipitating. However, it isn't necessary to use purified water, some salts are actually needed in the mash to facilitate enzyme activity. Unless you're sure the hose water is really poor/ hard/ salty/ alkaline, you should be able to use it.
I myself use rain water and add some salts like gypsum, epsom salts and chalk but only because our town water is slightly alkaline and highly variable. If you can, find out what your local supply is like for water quality, then you can adjust or dilute to suit the style of beer you're brewing, but initially I wouldn't be all that concerned.

Good luck tomorrow, hope it goes well! :cool:
Last edited by Ralph on 08 Oct 2010, 07:14, edited 5 times in total.
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Post #20 made 15 years ago
by jrodie
OK I just pulled the bag from my first BIAB and so far it was a little hard maintaining temps but I think I did an OK job. Some of the grain got through the bag and was left in the wort. I wouldn't say a lot of it did, but still more than I expected. How much is too much grain left in the kettle?

Post #21 made 15 years ago
by PistolPatch
Hope all is going well jr. If your grain got through the holes in your bag, then your bag may not be fine enough. See if you can take a close-up pic of the bag for us preferably with the grain still in it. From my limited understanding, I don't think there is a problem boiling the grain as long as your pH is okay - this is what is done in decoction mashing anyway. So, I wouldn't be worried mate.

Brew on and good luck! :)
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Post #22 made 15 years ago
by jrodie
Thanks, Too late for pics. I went ahead and used my bag as a strainer while pouring into the fermenter, and I think I got out most of the stuff that way. Some of the stuff that came out of the bag wasn't hard grain material but clumps of mushed grain. Next time I'll have an actual voile bag to use. Came out with about 71 percent efficiency so I guess that is pretty good for a first go. The recipe only calls for 1.049 OG and I got a 1.056, but used an extra pound of grain. Anyway that's my story if anyone is interested :)

Jim

Oh and thanks so much for this site and all the help people are willing to give.

Post #23 made 15 years ago
by hashie
Well done Jim, 71% is great for your first time. Most people on a 3v system aim for 60-65% first time.

I hope your beer turns out to be a ripper.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."

Post #24 made 15 years ago
by jrodie
So is it normal to have the lid of a fermenter bucket blow off with all grain? I just used the standard buckets a lot people have and it was filled right to the 5 gallon mark like usual. But the top blew off this morning. I have never had this happen with extract brews before.

Post #25 made 15 years ago
by BobBrews
jrodie,

Welcome to the club! I always keep my fermenting buckets in the spare shower with the drapes closed. Your air lock probably got clogged? Some yeast's really keep it up and blow. For me it's Nottingham! I rarely have this happen anymore. I just don't fill my bucket as full as I used too. It is much nicer to have one less mug of beer than to have to clean the stout off the shower walls. (it stains) at least mine did. if it happens a lot you may have to use a blow off tube. good luck
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