Stuck mash, Biab bags and recirculating

Post #1 made 11 years ago
Hi,

I'm not sure if this post is in the optimal place....

I'm designing an electric one-pot RIMS system where I use a BiaB bag to hold the grain during the mash. You could say: another Braumeister clone...

I'm not a real metal worker and my wife is handy with the sewing machine ;-) Therefore I opted for this bag solution instead of some metal false bottom with slits/holes that act as a sieve. I see quite a few people making 'Braumesiter' clones, using malt pipes and the like. In my first attempts, I used a false bottom (with big holes) and had the bag sitting on top of that, just to prevent it from touching the bottom/heater.
I use a small 12 Volt pump (the brown Chinese one ;-) that is rated 109 G/hr (6.9 L/min) and I found that it runs dry because the wort doesn't flow quickly enough through the grain bed and filterbag. In my first version, the bag was sitting against the wall of the brew kettle so that in the end only the bottom was 'available' as active filter area. The version I tried today is shaped like a bucket, so it tapers to the bottom, and hangs free in the kettle, so that the total submerged area is available for passing the liquid. But alas, still not good enough. Within 30 sec. you see the level of the wort rising inside the bag with 2 or 3 cm (1 inch) and it doesn't take much longer or the pump runs dry.

Especially when the system is heating up in a multi-step mash, I would like the pump to run continuously to avoid overshoots in temperature.

I read that even the Braumesiter suffers from this type of blocking with higher gravity beers. Therefore I was wondering what solutions people have come up with that work.
Just pumping slowly?
How much is slow or too fast?
What volume rate per area is more likely to work? (of course it also depends on the height of the grain bed.)
Any other solutions or ideas?

Thanks a million,


I've added a few pics to clarify
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Post #4 made 11 years ago
The perforated mash tun holds the bag I presume?
Is it NOT submerged in the tun below?
If not, isn't there much oxygen uptake during recirculation= I heard that was not so good...

What type of pump? How high is the flow?

Post #6 made 11 years ago
Jayb240 wrote:The Brew Bag lines the basket.
The basket is lowered into kettle.
Mash wort heats 5500 watt element.
Chugged Pump does recirculation during mash.
Ok, thanks.

With the bag in the shape it has now (bucket shape with 'solid' bottom), adding a basket only lowers the area that is available for passing liquid. The current bag does *NOT* touch anything, without the need for a basket to keep it in place. So I can't image that putting it in a basket would work.

There are so many variables:
* how fine is the grain?
* how fine is the mesh?
* how fast runs the pump?

I got a tip to leave the mash to settle for 10 minutes before starting to pump. Is that something you can comment on?
Last edited by Tytonegro on 20 Feb 2015, 19:45, edited 1 time in total.

Post #7 made 11 years ago
I use the exact same setup (bag in the big ol' basket) and have never had a problem with flow. My thinking with your setup is that the grain is packing into the bottom of your bag, and the flexibility of the bag is allowing is the grain to compact to the point water won't flow through it. Using the basket forms a solid, well, basket, that is full width across the bottom and keeps the grain from packing into a corner and, if nothing else, the water can flow over the top of the grain and out the sides, causing turbulence which tumbles the grain and keeps thing loose. I imagine there is at least some validity to this argument as I've seen my efficiencies go up quite a bit since I started stirring my mash a bit every 15 minutes. While I don't think I have ever had anything near a stuck sparge, the stirring gets the grain up and moving around a bit...kinda keeps things mixing and flowing, if you will. Anyway, i don't know how well I've explained this, but I think the rigid basket really helps!
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