Hi there Brendan,

There are a lot of points to cover here but I am running behind so what I'll do here is try and deal with your question in bite size chunks over several posts over a few days.

Firstly, any efficiency measurement (there are several different kinds) relies on taking a volume reading and a gravity reading so, before we can look at your "efficiency" we'll need to hear what volume you got and when.

The two most useful volume figures you can provide in this area are how much wort you ended up with in your fermentor as well as how much trub was left in your kettle. Do you know these?


PP

P.S. While you are waiting for me to reply to whatever answer you have to the above, if you get time, doing an Advanced Search of any posts done by me with the phrase "poor terminology" and "ambiguous" in them should reveal some light on some of your other questions.

Also, see if this post helps.

Brendan, that's great luck that Grain and Grape is your local .

What Paul has said about your OG is correct. Any recipe report's OG estimate in any program will have taken an efficiency figure into account. You are worried that your 'efficiency' is way out but let's take a closer look.

Remember above how I mentioned that any 'efficiency' figure is based on two things, volume and gravity? Imagine if on the above brew you had scored only l litre of wort at the end of the boil with a gravity of 1.046. That would be a hell of a lot less efficient than say 35 litres at 1.046. Why? Because efficiency is all about the total amount of sugar extracted from the grain. Looking at the gravity figure alone cannot not tell us how efficient we are.

How did you go?

See how in the Promash Report it has Batch Size and Wort Size and they both say 23 litres? In ProMash, Batch Size would normally be what we call 'Volume into Fermentor (VIF)' and Wort Size would be what we call 'End of Boil Volume (EOBV)'. [In fact we have two EOBV figures. EOBV means the volume at the end of the boil when hot. EOBV-A means the volume of wort at the end of the boil after it has cooled down to ambient temperature.]

If VIF equals EOBV, then the program is predicting you will have zero kettle trub. Obviously this is incorrect however many advanced brewers will set up programs like BeerSmith and Promash in this way to get around a whole lot of program design errors and limitations that I can't go into here.

Summarising, Promash predicted three things...

1. That you would have 23 litres at the end of the boil at 1.054
2. That you would get 23 litres into your fermentor at 1.054.
3. You would have no kettle trub.

You, in fact scored the following...

1. An EOBV-A of 28 litres at 1.046
2. A VIF of 23 litres at 1.046

Assuming the 5,250 grams of grain used was of average potential, then you achieved the following efficiencies...

An 'End of Boil Efficiency (EOBE)' of 82.8%
An 'Efficiency into Fermentor (EIF)' of 68.0%

The term 'Brewhouse Efficiency' used in lots of software can mean either one of the above efficiencies depending on how the user sets up the program so it has become a pretty deceptive and useless term as has 'batch size'. In any case, the 75% predicted by Promash does not match either of the above figures so straight away your recipe plan is flawed. The most important and useful of the above two efficiency figures is EOBE. The BIABacus estimates this for you and if you had used it, you would have been within 2% of the EOBE predicted. The BIABacus makes everything very easy.

On your next brew.

Incorrect efficiency predictions, poor program design and poor terminology really make things hard when using commercial software. It is exactly these things that lead to the problems you found on your brew. They also make posts like this incredibly hard and time-consuming to write as essentially, we are trying to bring some sort of clarity and order to what is basically one big ugly mess.

Before your next brew there are two choices. On one hand, I could give you links to extremely long and detailed threads here that will show you how to set up a Promash or Beersmith equipment profile to suit your set-up. It will take you hours to read and comprehend the limitations, the ambiguous terminology, the design flaws, the formula errors and what buttons you should never press etc, etc.

Or, we could spend a few minutes and use the BIABacus for your next brew.

So, before your next brew, maybe let us know a beer you'd like to brew. All you'll need to do then is tell us about three things and you'll be right to go. You'll also be able to email Paul with the exact ingredients and weights you want. Once the ingredients arrive, throw the amount of water into your pot that the BIABacus tells you to use and off you go.

Hopefully the second option sounds like a good plan to you.


PP