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Post #2 made 14 years ago
by rogerd
I created a false bottom by cutting up one of those skillet/frying pan splatter guards. It was the stainless steel perforated kind, so I knew it would not have metal problems.

Could have shelled out for a real false bottom, but this was available in the supermarket and I just cut off the handle . It has a slight dome to it.

It was really hard to find a good sized cake rack that would cover enough of the bottom that it would not let bits of the bag touch the kettle base, and also give a little bit of space for the heating water to circulate and reach equilibrium before contact.

IMO, most of the based needs to be covered and around 1-2cm off the base - you can always throw something under the heat guard to raise it if you are concerned.

In an earlier version, I even tried using 1/2inch silicon tubing to hold it off the kettle and that worked.

Post #3 made 14 years ago
by BobBrews
Gibbo,
I don't use any rack or grate to keep the bag off the bottom. I use a bungee cord. see here http://www.stempski.com/biab.php It also helps to keep the mash at a adjustable depth. I did (before the bungee) burn a bag but SHMBO sewed it up. I am still on my first bag! good luck
Last edited by BobBrews on 01 Jul 2010, 20:53, edited 6 times in total.
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Post #4 made 14 years ago
by hashie
I simply agitate the mash while I have the burners on. For the 10 minutes it takes to go from mash to mashout, I don't see the need for cake racks or other heat guards.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."

Post #5 made 14 years ago
by gibbo1
Cheers, thanks guys. I'm in the process of getting a bag from Gryphon so I should be able to bungee it over the sides. I'll look into something for the base also.

Post #7 made 14 years ago
by gibbo1
goldy wrote:Gibbo, I got one of those bags, they rock!! Depends on your setup too i guess, I have a 60ltr pot & don't bother with any racks or anything.
Good stuff, sounds like a good investment then. :D
Last edited by gibbo1 on 02 Jul 2010, 19:58, edited 6 times in total.

Post #8 made 14 years ago
by bigjoe
I had an old bagette screen from a bakery I worked at years ago. If they were too out of shape they'd toss them. I flattened it and put a few cheap stand offs from the hardware store. I had to cut into a circle also. I have a pump now but when I didn't recirculate I just stirred when the burner was on and didn't bother with a false botom.
Joe

Post #9 made 14 years ago
by bigjoe
I had an old baguette screen from a bakery I worked at years ago. If they were too out of shape they'd toss them. I flattened it and put a few cheap stand offs from the hardware store. I had to cut into a circle also. I have a pump now but when I didn't recirculate I just stirred when the burner was on and didn't bother with a false bottom.
Joe

Post #11 made 13 years ago
by rocket58
A cake rack (about $10 in a commercial cooking store)is perfect for my system,It is the perfect circumference for my pot and keeps the bag off the bottom great, Never have burn't the bag and keep stirring the mash every 15 min.. ;)
Last edited by rocket58 on 23 Aug 2010, 18:59, edited 6 times in total.
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Post #12 made 13 years ago
by PistolPatch
BobBrews wrote:Gibbo,
I don't use any rack or grate to keep the bag off the bottom. I use a bungee cord. see here http://www.stempski.com/biab.php It also helps to keep the mash at a adjustable depth. I did (before the bungee) burn a bag but SHMBO sewed it up. I am still on my first bag! good luck
Nice pics Bob!
NME wrote:An upside down collander??
It's hard finding something the right size/shape for your kettle though some brewers get lucky. I have heard of some guys having success with a colander in a tapered keggle. My colander only works well for my vegies though :).

I went through a stage where I really wanted to find something but nothing jumped out at me though some of the ideas above sound great. Now that I have a pulley system, I no longer have the need. If raising the temp during the mash by a degree or two, I'll just stir the mash. For mashout, I do the process as outlined in The Commentary where you basically just raise the bag.

I think, if you have a burner with a highly focussed flame (like a big bunsen burner) it is a good idea to find something to keep the bag away from this heat. A colander would serve that purpose perfectly. I also think it is not a good idea to use such a device as an excuse to not stir when adjusting your mash temp as the stirring leads to more accurate temp measurements etc.

Stirring all the time to achieve mashout temps can be tiring though with some set-ups and this is the place where such a device or a pulley will serve you best - that's if you even want to do a mash-out.

Cheers,
PP
Last edited by PistolPatch on 26 Aug 2010, 20:58, edited 6 times in total.
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Post #14 made 13 years ago
by nik
Hello mates. I just finished modifing my brewing vessel .It based on 60l insulated SS pot and I fit inside a 3 Kw electric element . I tested somehow my bag by putting inside some bottles and dunk them in the vessel with hot water (above 80 C) conducting direct the heating element surface while it was on . After 10-20 minutes I checked the bag and nothing was happened .
So I decided not to use a protective grill or something . Have you got similar experiences or I was lucky and the planned brewday will end to disaster ?
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Post #15 made 13 years ago
by argon5000
A cake rack is all but perfect for the job of keeping the bag off the base of the pot.

You essentially want as much empty space as possible, so that the wort does not get trapped under it. Upside down colanders, perforated mesh etc will hold the hot wort underneath, not allowing maximum fluidity. This will create large temp differentials in the mash. You may even denature the enzymes or scorch this portion of wort.

Even with a rack under the bag, it's always best to stir while adding heat. You want temps to be as equal as possible throughout the mash, including the free liquid under the bag.

Post #16 made 13 years ago
by PistolPatch
argon5000 wrote: Even with a rack under the bag, it's always best to stir while adding heat. You want temps to be as equal as possible throughout the mash, including the free liquid under the bag.
Too right argon. More below...
nik wrote:After 10-20 minutes I checked the bag and nothing had gone wrong. So I decided not to use a protective grill... was I lucky that the planned brewday did not end in disaster ?
Hi there nik*, gibbo etc,

What I think we are missing in this thread is asking the question, "Why will my bag burn?"

The answer is that your bag will not burn unless it reaches temperatures of well over 200 C if my memory serves me correctly.

A burner with a concentrated flame combined with a thin-bottomed pot will burn your bag. I mentioned before that I do not use any sort of device for my kettle bottom. Before I had a pulley I used to agitate any time whilst applying heat and I still do this when I mash. When I raise the temp to mash out I now lift my bag quite high and then apply the heat just as written in The Commentary.

argon's post above has made me think on this whole issue in a different way and I now think I am more sensible than I could have possibly imagined :lol:.

Seriously though, if it takes greater than 200 C to melt a bag, do we really want any of our wort getting anywhere near those temperatures?

Thanks argon for making me see this whole issue in an entirely different light.

:champ:
PP

*Changed your quote a bit mate to help this post flow a bit better. Hope that's okay ;).
Last edited by PistolPatch on 08 Jan 2011, 20:18, edited 6 times in total.
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Post #17 made 13 years ago
by nik
Hi Pat doesn't matter at all . I was experimenting with my old bag with the new system , in my previous set up (it was gas fired) I used to have a rack . At this one as it looks I wont use anything as the heating element is less powerful than gas I believe .
I am always agitating the mash when I power on so I believe this is a good measure against bag burn.
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Post #18 made 13 years ago
by EoinMag
I don't use anything myself, my vessel is large and I have a plimsoll line on the side of the bag that is measured to the distance of the element, so I know that if the line is outside the pot then I'm safe.
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Post #19 made 13 years ago
by gunner65
BobBrews wrote:Gibbo,
I don't use any rack or grate to keep the bag off the bottom. I use a bungee cord. see here http://www.stempski.com/biab.php It also helps to keep the mash at a adjustable depth. I did (before the bungee) burn a bag but SHMBO sewed it up. I am still on my first bag! good luck

Bob I am new to BIAB but have an all electric keggle steup and was wondering where you got that nice bag for the keggle? Or did your wife make it? Thanks
Last edited by gunner65 on 14 Jan 2011, 22:27, edited 6 times in total.

Post #20 made 13 years ago
by MTEXX
@PistolPatch, post #16
I concur.

I use a "banjo burner" which has a fairly disperse flame. I let my bag go all the way to the bottom and haven't had any melting problems in about 8 batches.

Post #21 made 13 years ago
by stux
I have a cake rack my wife picked up, it's perfect. 32 cm in a 40 cm pot seems to be fine, it lifts the bag about 1 cm off the bottom but has very little "substance" unlike a pizza tray

I tried a duck trivet once... That sucked, made it virtually impossible to stir

Don't forget to tue some cooking twine or something to the rack or you won't be able to get it out after the Nash and then it will make the whirlpool harder!
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