For me, Lukas gets first place on the tastings (Brown IPA), sinkas and Lukas get second place (mulberry Belgian Trippel and Oatmeal Stout). Third place probably a red IPA that Sarah and I brewed.

Brown IPA: 300 grams /  of whirlpool hops and then another 3000 grams of dry hops in... Well, I'm trying to work out what volume Lukas had? It was a "normal size batch" so let's assume 23L at flame-out. With those amount of hops, he probably got 18L into fermenter and 13L into the keg

Mulberry Belgian Trippel: I'm not into Belgians but this brew of sinkas, I certainly find enjoyable. The sweetness of the mulberries balanced out the phenolics (which I don't like) of the style. (I think I'm write in saying Belgian is a phenolic style?)

Oatmeal Stout: Another style I'm not that into but I enjoyed this one because it had lots to explore - silkiness, molasses, coffee etc.

Red IPA: Well, given the fact we used 500 grams less hops than Lukas , this beer is not bad. Definitely not a show winner as it won't stand out at all. It's very easy-drinking though, a bit of toffee sweetness which balances the hops. I better get sinkas to taste it as that toffee sweetness might actually be diacetyl and he's the king of diacetyl detection


[center]Next Event[/center]

This Friday, 6pm at The Queens in Beaufort Street, Mount Lawley.

If anyone wants to share an Uber in and back with Sarah and me, let me know.


Pat

Lukas: Received your recipe for your Brown IPA via email today. Thanks mate

Also delivered everyone's show entries, except for yours. It was just too niuce to be wasted on judges so I drank them instead. Thank you

Everyone Else: This year's exhibitor tasting (next Sat, 1st July, 12-5pm) is in a totally different part of the showground. In fact, it's basically on the complete opposite side so don't come in the usual entrance, use Gate 10 (first gate on Ashton Ave from railway line). The Centenary Pavillion is a few hundred yards from the gate.

Fun Fact: The Centenary Pavillion is adjacent to the Campbell Pavillion which is one of the places I used to show people how to walk on hot coals about 20 years ago. I still have occasional 'nightmares' (seriously) of forgetting to order the wood or there being a total fire ban. Luckily, neither of those things ever happened.

Thanks mate. They were very nice And Loch Street is correct

(You tested your thermometer yet?)

Today's the day

We have a few spare tickets. If anyone wants one, shoot me a PM

[WA Readers: Note The Royal Perth Beer Show 2018 thread. There's usually a spare ticket or two floating around to the Exhibitors Tasting so post there if you want one.]

Morning JayP and great to see you back into it

This thread has been quiet and we are due for a brew day. Might have to organise one for the start of the sunny season.

As for your brew, maybe post up what commercial examples of red ales or stouts you really like and then we can hone down a recipe for you. I know East Freo's a bit of a gallop from you however, lukasfab is dropping in later in the week during the evening to taste some beers so, if you can make it, you are most welcome. Not sure what evening though yet. He's great on the stouts too so could be worth the trip. If not, once w have more info, either someone here will help you out or I can (possibly over the phone as you are local).

First thing though is to list the commercial examples for us.


PP

Haven't had the first two but I see I can get them so will do so on Wed. As for the other two, yum!!!

Next questions are:
1. Will your Home Brew Shop weigh and crush for you? (i.e. can your order say 1835 grams of Malt A, 645 grams of Malt B etc)
2. What size packs does your HBS sell their hops in or do you have any in stock that isn't old in your freezer?
3. Is your Home Brew Shop close or will you be getting everything posted to you?
4. How often do you think you'll be brewing over the next few months?

Small batch sizes pose a few logistical problems so knowing the above will help make the right plan

Yep, the style names can be very confusing. The commercial examples you've given are definitely American.

The issue I'm trying to get my head around is it sounds like you've been doing Fresh Wort Kits in your Fermentasaurus and that's fine because FWK's are "standard" size batches - about 22L / 5.5gal Volume into Fermenter (VIF). Now you'll be brewing with a 19L / 5 gal pot, you're going to be getting a lot less VIF - about half that of your Fresh Wort Kit, maybe even less. There are ways of getting more but they are clumsy and require more vessels, time etc. You also said you want to experiment with small batches so let's stick to that.

What I'm thinking on is how to manage your ingredients. This is more difficult on small batches. For example, you'll only use half a packet of yeast on the brews I think we'll be aiming at. This means the other half goes to waste unless you brew another batch the next day or have some way of vacuum sealing. You can however harvest and wash yeast and it will store very well in your fridge. Hops can also be stored quite successfully given the right packaging and handling. Crushed grain can also be stored (in our climate) fairly successfully, once again given the right packaging.

So, Jay, my concern is not so much in finding you some great recipes - that'll be easy - my worries are: ensuring you know what ingredient resources you have available to you (TWOC is quite a drive from your place and you don't want to be spending an hour in travel or paying courier fees for every 10 L batch!) and knowing what storage capabilities (and knowledge) you have. Do you have a lot of tupperware? (I'm serious about that. I have heaps!)

So, what I'm thinking is if you can decide on what you'd like to brew for say your next three batches, then we can make a plan of what ingredients to buy, the order to brew the beers in and how to manage the ingredients between brews. If the shop around the corner will crush a small mixed grain bill for you, then that only leaves hops and yeast to manage. Dried yeast is about $5 a packet and you might be happy to throw the unused portion in the bin or you might prefer to wash and re-use it.

The grain is the main issue and you'll need to phone the shop to find answers to the following:

1. If they are just around the corner, are they happy to crush small mixed bills?
2. If they are not, then who will and how far away are they or what are their delivery costs?
3. Some shops can vacuum small crushed malt bills. In other words, you could order three crushed bills and have them delivered to you vacuum-sealed for the same delivery charge as a single small malt bill. (I used to get that done on the east coast but have never investigated it since coming back here so you might have to ring around a bit.)

So, check that out. After that, you might come back here and say, okay, I want my next three brews to be an American Red Ale, an Imperial Red Ale and a Stout. Or you might just say, I just want to brew an American Red and I want to brew it now!!!

I've probably got all you need here if you want to do the latter... Remember above I mentioned Lukas (and probably Case) are dropping in later this week for a tasting and you were welcome? If you have the right tupperware and bring some nice beers, we could design your beer on the spot and send you home with all you need. And you'd get to taste our show beers. (Bring your hydrometer/s and thermometer/s too so as you can check their accuracy.) It doesn't get much better than that

Only problem with that offer is that I have no idea at this stage what evening [mention]lukasfab[/mention] has in mind

Anyway, that's some stuff for you to investigate tomorrow.


PP

That's good news! And, I really like your choice of styles. It has my brain ticking over already with a few ideas - one of them is something I've never thought of before and could be another world-first (should you choose to accept this mission etc, etc ).

Have just finished writing a post that took three hours (I seem to be back to my old bad habits). Enjoyable as that was, as mentioned in my PM I only just realised that you'll be coming to my place this weekend, not the one after, so my plan to work on your recipes in this thread isn't going to work

What I'll Do

My next few days are full however I'll ponder a broad plan and probably email a few people re what I'm thinking including @lukasfab who'll be dropping in his show beers.

What You Can Do

1. Remember to bring your hydrometer/s and thermometer/s.
2. Do as much research as possible on the three beers/styles you mentioned.

That three hour post I just finished reminded me of when I was brewing a saison for the first time. In addition to asking for advice here, I researched and copied and pasted a whole lot of info into a single file. So, you'll need to do the same. You'll want to be looking for style descriptions, blogs, magazine articles, clone recipes etc that will give you either hints or actual info on ABV's, malts, hops, yeasts used etc, etc. A lot of info you come across will be contradictory but that exercise will be of great value to you. When you do come over with your info (or email it to me before) we'll check it against some other sources I have here and come up with a solid plan.

See you Sunday

[Reminder: Royal Perth Beer Show Toasting coming up on 14th July ]

Good to hear your day went smoothly James

Sorry we never got a chance to do some BIABacus education when you dropped in. My place is slowly getting back in order now though.

Make sure you read the Clear Brewing Terminology thread as phrases like, "to make 11 L of wort," can mean anything. Just because you are not fast chilling doesn't mean you need to change your hop addition time. Search here for "Chilling Myths - Asking the Right Questions."

Not sure if we spoke on ball-valves when you dropped in but you need to keep a close eye on them. Search for "nostril test," here will bring up some goodies. Also remember 90 minute boil advise as it is necessary in some scenarios.

On the OG side, the BIABacus said to buy 2.85kg of grain but your HBS told you to buy more than that. Two things need mentioning here. On a brew like that, you should be getting more than what you need working from BIABacus defaults. In other words, 2.85kg of grain should have been more than enough. Secondly, no one can predict your OG unless they know a number of factors, one important one being evaporation rate which varies from day to day.

The only numbers we really have to work off are, "1.053 at around 12.5 L." Let's say the 12.5 L was at flame-out. When cooled it will shrink by 4% so we get 12L. What this is telling me is what you extracted from your grain was less than what it should have been. With 3.2 kg of grain you should have been able to get more like 12 L of Ambient Wort @ 1.060.

So, what we are seeing here is "sugar" in the grain not being extracted as efficiently as it could have been.

This is no big deal atm but it is important to understand it.

We'll talk more at the show tasting
Pat

P.S. Also search here for the phrase, "kissed on the bum by an angel."

[I think we've wandered off-topic a fair bit as we're really talking recipes now. I'm not sure though where the posts should be moved to as we've gone from stouts to NEIPA's ]

Saw your post from 4 weeks ago and kept meaning to ask you about it. I meant to ask you to post up your BIABacus file too as it makes it easier to "see." (Basically, I can change one number and then see what your batch would look like if I was brewing a "normal batch size" of it.) I can't remember what Innate's Pale Ale tastes like but they make excellent beer.

What I've done in my head though is doubled everything so I can picture a brew of 22 litres into fermenter. A few things threw me. The ingredients, for me at least, don't match the title of a "Juicy Pale Ale." Juicy implies a NEIPA type of ale and you'd want oats and a higher percentage of wheats for that. The biscuit and Munich aren't needed either for a NEIPA.

Another thing that stands out is the 30 minute hop addition. For me, 30 minute additions are "no-mans" land. You'll get very little, if any flavour from them so you need to ask yourself what is the purpose of that addition? If you want bitterness then add less, earlier. If you want flavour, add it later.

As mentioned above, I can't remember what Innate's Pale Ale tastes like but if it is a "juicy" pale ale, then I'd change the hop schedule dramatically so as to get more bang for your buck. You have 100 grams of hops to play with and, on a batch that size, that's lots to play with. I'd probably go something like 10 grams at 5 mins, 30 grams at the bottom of your cube and run your hot wort on to that. Then 30 grams just after high krausen and your last 30 grams after ferment is completed and you start your crash chill (assuming you can do a crash chill???)

You mentioned it's tasting pretty bitter atm. It should balance out somewhat but this might take 4 weeks. And if it remains bitter, don't be scared to blend it with a less bitter beer you may have brewed or will brew.

The main things on recipes are to be clear on what you want and then get a recipe from someone you trust or do lots of research. Very few recipes you stumble across on the net are of high quality. Thousands upon thousands are uploaded before the publisher/uploader has even brewed the recipe themselves. And, when you do stumble across a recipe that is well thought out, they're often published in a form that is vague or very difficult to translate.

There's two good threads on this site to check your recipe over before you brew it. They are...
Does this recipe have integrity? Can I copy it?
Use this thread to convert recipes to suit your equipment...

After saying/writing all that, I can see no reason why the beer you've brewed, while it may not be what you expected, won't be very tasty. Save a bit for me if you can. I'd certainly like to try it.


Pat