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I'm loving No-Chill.

Post #1 made 9 years ago
by hathro
MODNOTE: The post below and several after were copied/moved from this thread as they have lead to a separate discussion. I trust my new topic title is okay but feel free to change it hathro.

No-chilling has saved me a ton of time as it decouples the brewing and fermenting. You'll save time not having to chill the wort, clean the chiller, sanitise your fermentation vessel, pitch yeast etc. You can also store your wort for months and ferment when you have a spare 30 mins.

Also, you can purchase another urn and do two batches at the same time. It's not that much more effort and will save you 5+ hours. When you factor in the time, the $200 outlay for an urn will soon be forgotten.
Last edited by hathro on 15 Sep 2014, 14:12, edited 1 time in total.

Post #2 made 9 years ago
by HbgBill
I remember a bit of discussion about no-chill and eventually bought two 5g containers from US Plastics.. which I have never used. The reason?

I can't get by the thought that until the wort drops down to something like 170*F, DMS is still being produced. I'd like to understand the DMS issue a bit more. Is it a wives tale? I think I can wrap myself around the cold break issue tho.. as it all settles out in the end. I'd prefer to have it separated during transfer by chilling rapidly. But, possibly it's my "tradition" conditioning?
Bill
Hop Song Brewing-Santa Rosa, California

Post #3 made 9 years ago
by joshua
Bill, DMS is REAL!!!

It comes from SMM, in the Grain, and convert to DMS when Heated (during Malting), It is very soluble, and evaporates around 98F to 102F.

It may take as much as 10-15 minutes to Boil off all the DMS, as long as there is no condensation in the Kettle, or lid on the Kettle.

You can, as I do, wait until the Wort has cooled to 160F, and then add it to the No-chill units, I no-chill in the Fermenter.
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
    • SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America

Post #4 made 9 years ago
by HbgBill
Yes, have no question about DMS being real. The comment is based on the various reputable podcasts saying that DMS continues to be produced until it get's below that number. But, I see it taking quite a bit of time to get below 160* (or 170*..couldn't remember). So, if not quickly cooled.. how much is produced?

Only you no chillers can tell me. I'd guess in very light beers it might be noticeable.. ? But in heavier, dark beers not so much? Same for highly hopped beers ?

I don't brew for any competition purposes.. yet. But, I'd hate to have something poo poo'ed due to something I have/had control over.

PP and others.. I'm not poo poo'ing the process.. just raising valid questions from someone who may have been 'twisted' by the Fiddler on the Roof... Tradition, tradition, tradition.
Bill
Hop Song Brewing-Santa Rosa, California

Post #7 made 9 years ago
by joshua
I found a very technical abstract that tested Barley malt and determined the Content of SMM in malted Barley.

"The SMM content varied from 4.6-19 µg DMS equivalent/g of dry malt."

see...

http://www.asbcnet.org/publications/jou ... /44-01.htm

I think 19 micrograms in 1 gram of Barley is about 19 parts per Million........
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
    • SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America

Post #9 made 9 years ago
by hathro
Honestly, DMS isn't an issue with no-chilling. PP has said doing a 90 minute boil combats it. Either way, in Australia we no-chill all the time. They even sell cubes of wort at the home brew shop. The general process is stop the boil and whirlpool. Generally 5-10 minutes later, siphon the wort into a cleaned and sanitized cube. Then put the cube up against a wall with the lid on loosely and shove your knee into it to expel as much air as you can. Then pop the lid on (be careful not to burn your knee - cubers will know what I'm talking about.

Place the cube on its side so the near boiling wort touches all the surfaces in this case, the handle above the lid. 10 mins later, place somewhere until it cools.

It can be a bit to get your head around but it works and we've been doing it for years with great results. Don't bother waiting for it to cool, whirlpool, then siphon.

Post #10 made 9 years ago
by HbgBill
Thanks. I just watched a video with big bad Bob S. demo'ing the process. Looks peachy keen. Guess I'll have to try a batch. Unfortunately, I only bought the large 5gallon containers. I need to find something smaller to do half batches.
Bill
Hop Song Brewing-Santa Rosa, California

Post #11 made 9 years ago
by jhough
Bill, How did yours turn out ? Been thinking about no chill to get a batch or 2 ahead because of time constraints.
Joe
    • SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America

Post #13 made 9 years ago
by PistolPatch
hathro wrote:Honestly, DMS isn't an issue with no-chilling. PP has said doing a 90 minute boil combats it.
Just trying to catch up on the last few weeks or more here and this quote caught my eye. It's really easy to misquote someone when you read a lot and I'm sure I have done it several times without realising it :). This site encourages corrections so I thought I better say that when I recommend a 90 minute boil, DMS is actually the furthest thing from my mind. I actually have very little knowledge of DMS. I think (but am not completely confident) I can taste it but have never read up fully on its causes so I'm definitely not an authority in this area sorry.

The other issue is, as in all brewing, that we often think that our method is exactly the same as everyone elses. For example, one brewer might think that everyone no-chills the same way as every other "no-chiller" whereas the reality is that there are many forms. This is why details are important. Details are needed to birth definitions which can really speed things up for everyone. This whole chilling area needs a lot more definitions and a lot of thought needs to be put into it. Certainly worthy of a new thread....

In fact, pitching time would be a far better way to think of this whole area....

Fast Pitching (Active Chilling) - Requires some sort of chiller
ASAP Pitching (Passive Kettle Chilling) - Requires no chiller. Wait for wort to cool naturally in kettle and then pitch.
Delayed Pitching (Passive 'Cube' Chilling) - Requires no chiller. Wait for wort to cool naturally in cube and pitch at a date of one's choosing (say up to a year).

I believe that some similiar terms were proposed on this site quite some time ago but may have been lost behind the scenes. Probably time we thought on this more and got the terminology sorted?

:think:
Last edited by PistolPatch on 26 Dec 2014, 23:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #14 made 9 years ago
by joshua
PP, you could change the

"Fast Pitching (Active Chilling) - Requires some sort of chiller" to


"ASAFP Pitching (Active Chilling) - Requires some sort of chiller"

JMHO
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
    • SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America

Post #15 made 9 years ago
by PistolPatch
Lol Josh :P. If I saw ASAFP pitching I would read it as, "As soon as f'ckn possible" pitching :). (Is that what you meant? :lol:)

My notes above were only meant to be the beginning of a conversation, preferably a whole new thread. The terminology that is great on this site has never been an easy solve. No matter how easy and obvious in hindsight, it has always taken hours, months and, in a few cases, several years to resolve. The great thing is that many members here now have seen how important a name is, what a massive difference it can make and how pure it needs to be to make such a difference.

So, we should be getting faster at this sort of very detailed thinking now.

:peace:
PP
Last edited by PistolPatch on 27 Dec 2014, 01:17, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #16 made 9 years ago
by joshua
Yes, because So Many can't wait for the Chiller to cool the wort, Either.
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
    • SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
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