I just finished pulling the bag for a version of my AG BIAB house beer. I have a 16 gallon (60L) pot and it now has 8 gallons of wort in it.
I still make an extract version of the same house beer when I don’t have time to do AG.
Looking at that half empty pot, just after pulling the bag, I was tempted to add extract and water in the proportions that I use for the extract house beer, to double the batch and make two cornys of partial mash.
I might try that next time.
Any issues with doing that? is there a better way?
Post #2 made 12 years ago
Gr, That is a Hybrid BIAB/Extact mash. Kind of like a partial mash, but it is a Full mash-extract wort!
Go for it and let us Know how it Finishes!!
Go for it and let us Know how it Finishes!!
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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Post #3 made 12 years ago
Thanks for the feedback Joshua,
I wonder if I can put that into Biabacus. I'll have a look. I don't need to, but I'm really enjoying fiddling with that program now, learning it's ins and outs.
I wonder if I can put that into Biabacus. I'll have a look. I don't need to, but I'm really enjoying fiddling with that program now, learning it's ins and outs.
Guinges
Post #4 made 12 years ago
One thing I always avoided after my Kit & Kilo days was adding sugar to a wort, as it always just "seemed" inferior. However, I do wonder how much you could get away with when adding sugar to an AG wort, as it was probably the 2 year old stale LME that caused the bad taste. 
I wonder if anybody has experience of a "safe" percentage of sugar addition to an AG wort?
My thinking is, could you avoid the DME route and just add sugar & water to get your 16 Gallons (50%)?? It would make it a lot cheaper.
I wonder if anybody has experience of a "safe" percentage of sugar addition to an AG wort?
My thinking is, could you avoid the DME route and just add sugar & water to get your 16 Gallons (50%)?? It would make it a lot cheaper.
G B
I spent lots of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I squandered
I've stopped drinking, but only when I'm asleep
I ONCE gave up women and alcohol - it was the worst 20 minutes of my life
I spent lots of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I squandered
I've stopped drinking, but only when I'm asleep
I ONCE gave up women and alcohol - it was the worst 20 minutes of my life
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Post #5 made 12 years ago
Sounds like a recipe for moonshine.........reckon that instead of kegging, you'd distill that after it ferments outmally wrote:My thinking is, could you avoid the DME route and just add sugar & water to get your 16 Gallons (50%)?? It would make it a lot cheaper.
Last edited by thughes on 25 Feb 2013, 06:38, edited 2 times in total.
WWBBD?
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Post #6 made 12 years ago
why would you? I've never heard an all grain brewer say that they prefer kit and kilo, so why taint a good beer with thin watery crap?
would you make a fresh ground coffee then chuck a spoon full of instant on top?
Just make your extract version in a second keg, put the 2 side by side and see which one gets finished first
would you make a fresh ground coffee then chuck a spoon full of instant on top?
Just make your extract version in a second keg, put the 2 side by side and see which one gets finished first
Post #7 made 12 years ago
Aces High, Did I mention they were both house beers, so yes we do that and the AG does get drunk first, so I understand your point. But when we run out of the AG one, we are almost as happy with the extract version.Aces high wrote:why would you? I've never heard an all grain brewer say that they prefer kit and kilo, so why taint a good beer with thin watery crap?
would you make a fresh ground coffee then chuck a spoon full of instant on top?
Just make your extract version in a second keg, put the 2 side by side and see which one gets finished first
Both beers are all about hops rather than grains and have a single large hop bursting addition which we love. So I think that’s why there isn’t a huge difference for us. Last night we only had the extract version and we were very happy with it. So I’m less concerned about combining those two particular beers in order to top the pot up. I think I might end up with a double batch with negligible detriment to quality.
Doesn’t Guinness have some extract in it?
Commercial beer has lots of sugar in it I’m sure, and made as cheaply as possible.
Mally’s question was an interesting one. I hope someone knows the answer.
How much sugar can you use before the beer ends up tasting like a commercial beer?
I’m sure the big brewers research that question constantly, or maybe they don’t care and focus on marketing instead.
Last edited by GuingesRock on 25 Feb 2013, 07:21, edited 2 times in total.
Guinges
Post #8 made 12 years ago
GR wrote
"I’m sure the big brewers research that question constantly, or maybe they don’t care and focus on marketing instead."
Do ya think?
"I’m sure the big brewers research that question constantly, or maybe they don’t care and focus on marketing instead."
Do ya think?
AWOL
Post #9 made 12 years ago
Good Day or Somthing like that, There is no Sugar in American Mega Swill....It is 40% Rice, that is Cereal mashed. Rice IS MUCH cheaper than Sugar!!!
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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Post #10 made 12 years ago
That's all i was doing by the way. Just asking if anybody knew of a SAFE dilution rate. It may be that 5% is too much?Mally’s question was an interesting one. I hope someone knows the answer.
My thinking was GR has 3 options to get 16 gallons;
1) Do 2 brews
2) top up with DME & water
3) top up with sugar & water
If nobody has prior experience GR, then maybe you can be the pioneer? (could be an expensive experiment if it doesn't come out right though).
Last edited by mally on 25 Feb 2013, 15:55, edited 2 times in total.
G B
I spent lots of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I squandered
I've stopped drinking, but only when I'm asleep
I ONCE gave up women and alcohol - it was the worst 20 minutes of my life
I spent lots of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I squandered
I've stopped drinking, but only when I'm asleep
I ONCE gave up women and alcohol - it was the worst 20 minutes of my life
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Post #11 made 12 years ago
Hi Mally. Time is precious for me so I wouldn’t like to risk screwing up an AG batch by throwing sugar in it, but I have a thing against sugar in general life any way. I didn’t want to try adding extract to yesterday’s batch, as it was a FWH experiment. If I like it I think I might try the Hybrid. It kills me when I take all the trouble to make an AG batch and people come around and knock back the entire keg in an evening and ask for more. That might be enough to tip me over the edge and start making Joshua’s “Mega-Swill”
The other option I suppose is to get a larger AG setup...a keggle, or a huge pot like Aces has.
Joshua, that was very interesting. I always thought the Chinese were planning to take over the world. They send large boxes of tiny pieces of plastic over here with impossible instructions on how to put them together and exciting pictures of toys on the boxes to attract the children. Chinese restaurants full of eat-all-you-can (or is it all-you-can-eat) hydrogenated fat and sugar, stuff that a Chinese person would never eat (ever seen an overweight Chinese restaurant worker?). I think the Chinese eat rice, fish and vegetables in healthy quantities.
When the Chinese take over completely they will hold back the rice, the Mega Swill industry will come to a standstill and western civilisation will collapse into a state of complete chaos.
The other option I suppose is to get a larger AG setup...a keggle, or a huge pot like Aces has.
Joshua, that was very interesting. I always thought the Chinese were planning to take over the world. They send large boxes of tiny pieces of plastic over here with impossible instructions on how to put them together and exciting pictures of toys on the boxes to attract the children. Chinese restaurants full of eat-all-you-can (or is it all-you-can-eat) hydrogenated fat and sugar, stuff that a Chinese person would never eat (ever seen an overweight Chinese restaurant worker?). I think the Chinese eat rice, fish and vegetables in healthy quantities.
When the Chinese take over completely they will hold back the rice, the Mega Swill industry will come to a standstill and western civilisation will collapse into a state of complete chaos.
Guinges
Post #12 made 12 years ago
Sounds like you need to do an experiment GR!
Next time you do a brew;
Siphon off your wort into 2 x 1 Gallon containers & ferment all 3 separately, at the same time, same conditions, same yeast etc.
One original, one with DME, one with sugar. See if you can tell the difference between the DME & sugar (there will be a hop difference due to dilution against the standard).
If it doesn't produce nice beer, give that to your guzzling friends
Next time you do a brew;
Siphon off your wort into 2 x 1 Gallon containers & ferment all 3 separately, at the same time, same conditions, same yeast etc.
One original, one with DME, one with sugar. See if you can tell the difference between the DME & sugar (there will be a hop difference due to dilution against the standard).
If it doesn't produce nice beer, give that to your guzzling friends
G B
I spent lots of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I squandered
I've stopped drinking, but only when I'm asleep
I ONCE gave up women and alcohol - it was the worst 20 minutes of my life
I spent lots of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I squandered
I've stopped drinking, but only when I'm asleep
I ONCE gave up women and alcohol - it was the worst 20 minutes of my life
-
- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From Great Britain
-
Post #13 made 12 years ago
GuingesRock wrote:Aces High, Did I mention they were both house beers, so yes we do that and the AG does get drunk first, so I understand your point. But when we run out of the AG one, we are almost as happy with the extract version.Aces high wrote:why would you? I've never heard an all grain brewer say that they prefer kit and kilo, so why taint a good beer with thin watery crap?
would you make a fresh ground coffee then chuck a spoon full of instant on top?
Just make your extract version in a second keg, put the 2 side by side and see which one gets finished first
Both beers are all about hops rather than grains and have a single large hop bursting addition which we love. So I think that’s why there isn’t a huge difference for us. Last night we only had the extract version and we were very happy with it. So I’m less concerned about combining those two particular beers in order to top the pot up. I think I might end up with a double batch with negligible detriment to quality.
Doesn’t Guinness have some extract in it?
Commercial beer has lots of sugar in it I’m sure, and made as cheaply as possible.
Mally’s question was an interesting one. I hope someone knows the answer.
How much sugar can you use before the beer ends up tasting like a commercial beer?
I’m sure the big brewers research that question constantly, or maybe they don’t care and focus on marketing instead.
Ok, but im still standing by my original theme of "Just dont do it" Im like the pessimist nike guy.
Keep ya grain and extract seperate and feed the extract to your bludging friends
Last edited by Aces high on 25 Feb 2013, 21:08, edited 2 times in total.
Post #14 made 12 years ago
Sneaky ideaAces high wrote:Keep ya grain and extract seperate and feed the extract to your bludging friends
didn't think of that one.
Last edited by GuingesRock on 25 Feb 2013, 21:58, edited 2 times in total.
Guinges
Post #15 made 12 years ago
Hmmm.
Alcohol made with sugar and yeast only and a pound of hops. I wonder how would that taste???
AG with pale malt only and no hops. I wonder how that would that taste???
Alcohol made with sugar and yeast only and a pound of hops. I wonder how would that taste???
AG with pale malt only and no hops. I wonder how that would that taste???
Guinges
Post #16 made 12 years ago
GR, I call it "Hop Wine" basically useless, unless you want to adjust "Store bought" beers or your own!!
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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Post #17 made 12 years ago
A pound or two of table sugar to boost alcohol is perfectly acceptable to the "experts"? 
It ferments out and doesn't affect blood sugar or turn into fat any quicker than when it is in the finished beer? 
If a pound or two of Belgian Candi Sugar is normal in Belgian triples than it is acceptable in a Black IPA.
I avoid sugar, bread and most refined grains but...... When it comes to beer or alcohol in general. I go for it! 
It ferments out and doesn't affect blood sugar or turn into fat any quicker than when it is in the finished beer? If a pound or two of Belgian Candi Sugar is normal in Belgian triples than it is acceptable in a Black IPA. I avoid sugar, bread and most refined grains
but...... When it comes to beer or alcohol in general. I go for it! tap 1 Raspberry wine
tap 2 Bourbon Barrel Porter
tap 3 Czech Pilsner
tap 4 Triple IPA 11% ABV
Pipeline: Mulled Cider 10% ABV
http://cheesestradamus.com/ Brewers challenge!
tap 2 Bourbon Barrel Porter
tap 3 Czech Pilsner
tap 4 Triple IPA 11% ABV
Pipeline: Mulled Cider 10% ABV
http://cheesestradamus.com/ Brewers challenge!
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Post #18 made 12 years ago
GR, Your kettle is half full NOT half empty !!! 
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Post #19 made 12 years ago
Mad_Scientist wrote:GR, Your kettle is half full NOT half empty !!!
I’m really curious to know what an AG batch without hops would taste like, it would help me to know what flavours are contributed to by the grains and alcohol alone. I might make a hopless 2 gallon test batch.
My next curiosity after that would be how that would taste with a shot of Bob's hop vodka in the glass with it.
Then after trying those two things I could dry hop the keg to learn about the flavour of dry hopping.
Has anyone ever tried any of thse things?
Bob, What do you think about the idea of hopping with your hop vodka only. I geuss it wouldn't be bitter, but it would have lots of flavour and aroma. I wonder what beer like that would be like...might not be very good, but then it could be really good.
Last edited by GuingesRock on 26 Feb 2013, 08:23, edited 2 times in total.
Guinges
Post #20 made 12 years ago
GR, If you ever had a Schiltz "Malt liquer" it was a Unhopped pilzner lager. Bome people grew up with NO or very low hopped beers(me), and really have trouble with "frizzy yellow Hop Soda.
Check post#16 for my Hop wine, it allows time to test malt flavours, and then see how different Hop Bitterness, flavour and aroma works with the beer.
It is a lot like SMASH, just adjustable.
I have checked with some Other Brewers in my area (N.Alabama) where 3 vessel brewing rules and EVERYBODY has DME to bring low S.G. up to proper levels(thier Effiency Sucks they way they brew)
So use DME to bring up you S.G. really works and it seems that BIABacus allow this in the program like sugar.
Check post#16 for my Hop wine, it allows time to test malt flavours, and then see how different Hop Bitterness, flavour and aroma works with the beer.
It is a lot like SMASH, just adjustable.
I have checked with some Other Brewers in my area (N.Alabama) where 3 vessel brewing rules and EVERYBODY has DME to bring low S.G. up to proper levels(thier Effiency Sucks they way they brew)
So use DME to bring up you S.G. really works and it seems that BIABacus allow this in the program like sugar.
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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Post #21 made 12 years ago
Wow! Interesting! Just the kind of info I wanted. Thanks very much Joshua.
Edit: Gave it a try here: http://www.biabrewer.info/viewtopic.php ... 015#p29334
Edit: Gave it a try here: http://www.biabrewer.info/viewtopic.php ... 015#p29334
Last edited by GuingesRock on 26 Feb 2013, 09:18, edited 3 times in total.
Guinges
Post #22 made 12 years ago
GuingesRock,
Try it
I use a ounce of hops in hop vodka and since I don't boil it. I don't extract the Alpha's and certain bittering flavors that aren't actually bittering oils at all. I would say it wouldn't work right? You extract the flavoring or aroma oils and a little in a glass of beer is perfect. Maybe it would make a interesting experiment?Bob, What do you think about the idea of hopping with your hop vodka only. I geuss it wouldn't be bitter, but it would have lots of flavour and aroma. I wonder what beer like that would be like...might not be very good, but then it could be really good.
Try it
Last edited by BobBrews on 26 Feb 2013, 21:34, edited 2 times in total.
tap 1 Raspberry wine
tap 2 Bourbon Barrel Porter
tap 3 Czech Pilsner
tap 4 Triple IPA 11% ABV
Pipeline: Mulled Cider 10% ABV
http://cheesestradamus.com/ Brewers challenge!
tap 2 Bourbon Barrel Porter
tap 3 Czech Pilsner
tap 4 Triple IPA 11% ABV
Pipeline: Mulled Cider 10% ABV
http://cheesestradamus.com/ Brewers challenge!
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- SVA Brewer With Over 100 Brews From United States of America
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Post #23 made 12 years ago
I want to make a ten gallon batch of 8% or 9% double IPA in a 16 Gal pot. Although the hybrid extract thing seems to work, extract is expensive and a pain to dissolve. I think I would rather get the OG as high as I can with grain (about 1.065 for 10 gal in that sized pot) and then take it the rest of the way with sugar.BobBrews wrote:A pound or two of table sugar to boost alcohol is perfectly acceptable to the "experts"?
I avoid sugar, bread and most refined grains
According to Mitch Steel’s IPA book that’s normal practice for double IPA’s to bring up the OG with "brewing sugar." Recommended not to go higher than 1.095 OG “or the beer will be too sweet and malty”
What I don’t know is should I use cheap table sugar to make this double IPA, or would I have a better product if I used dextrose or something else. Can anyone advise or comment please?
Happy Easter!
Last edited by GuingesRock on 29 Mar 2013, 17:19, edited 2 times in total.
Guinges
Post #24 made 12 years ago
GR, if you want that Double IPA the be "dry" and up to 12%ABV.....you can try Wine Yeast. see
http://www.eckraus.com/red-star-yeast.html for example.
Bring the wort to 1.080OG and try a "barley wine" double IPA. You will need to Carbonate this by Tank.
http://www.eckraus.com/red-star-yeast.html for example.
Bring the wort to 1.080OG and try a "barley wine" double IPA. You will need to Carbonate this by Tank.
Honest Officer, I swear to Drunk, I am Not God.
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